Don't Kill the Messenger with Movie Strategist Kevin Goetz

Send Kevin a Text Message
Mark Johnson, Academy Award-winning producer of Rain Man and Emmy Award-winning executive producer of Breaking Bad, joins host Kevin Goetz for a conversation about a career defined by creative restlessness and uncommon decency. The interview ranges from his transformative partnership with Barry Levinson, which produced Diner, The Natural, and Good Morning Vietnam, to shepherding beloved films like The Notebook, A Little Princess, Donnie Brasco, and Galaxy Quest to championing an unknown writer named Vince Gilligan, Johnson reflects on what it means to serve a director's vision, why he refuses to make the same movie twice, and how audience testing changed the way he thinks about filmmaking.
Never the Same Movie Twice (02:14): Johnson explains his resistance to repeating himself across genres. From Galaxy Quest to The Notebook to Breaking Bad, he compares his varied tastes to simply deciding what he wants for breakfast.
Meeting Barry Levinson (04:07): Johnson recalls how a chance connection on the Mel Brooks comedy launched one of Hollywood's most fruitful producing partnerships, and what he learned from working alongside a director who always began with character.
The Lesson of Good Morning Vietnam (13:12): Johnson describes how audience testing transformed his understanding of filmmaking, including working with the mercurial and brilliant Robin Williams and the pivotal decision to restore a scene with J.T. Walsh.
Winning the Oscar for Rain Man (18:29): Johnson reflects on the bittersweet experience of winning Best Picture for a film he credits largely to others, Tom Cruise's underappreciated subtlety in the role, and the one name he forgot to thank from the podium.
The Closest Thing to a Perfect Movie (26:08): Johnson singles out Alfonso Cuarón's A Little Princess as the film he holds most dear as a lesson in collaborative craftsmanship.
Discovering Vince Gilligan (30:06): In 1988, Johnson read a script by an unknown writer at a Virginia Film Festival jury and knew immediately he was in the presence of singular talent. He details how he championed Gilligan for years before Breaking Bad made the world take notice.
The Producer's True Role (38:57): Johnson shares what he hopes listeners take away — that his passion for moviemaking is as alive today as when he started, and that a producer's job is never to claim ownership of a film, but to help a director realize their vision.

Host: Kevin Goetz
Guest: Mark Johnson
Producer: Kari Campano
Writers: Kevin Goetz, Darlene Hayman, and Kari Campano
Audio Engineer: Gary Forbes (DG Entertainment)
For more information about Mark Johnson:
Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_Johnson_(producer)
IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0425741/
L
For more information about Kevin Goetz:
- Website: www.KevinGoetz360.com
- Audienceology Book: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Audience-ology/Kevin-Goetz/9781982186678
- How to Score in Hollywood: https://www.amazon.com/How-Score-Hollywood-Secrets-Business/dp/198218986X/
- Facebook, X, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, Substack: @KevinGoetz360
- LinkedIn @Kevin Goetz
- Screen Engine/ASI Website: www.ScreenEngineASI.com

Send Kevin a Text Message
Ann Sarnoff, the first woman to serve as Chair and CEO of a major Hollywood studio and named one of Forbes' World's Most Powerful Women, joins host Kevin Goetz for a conversation about her path from a working-class upbringing in Massachusetts to the top of the entertainment industry. From her early days at Nickelodeon pioneering audience research, to guiding Warner Bros. through one of the most turbulent periods in Hollywood history, to her current role on the boards of major entertainment companies, Sarnoff shares insights on leadership, the power of knowing your audience, and what theaters must do to survive.
From Wilbraham to Warner Bros. (03:11): Sarnoff discusses her roots in a blue-collar, Polish-Catholic family in Massachusetts, where she played three varsity sports, instilling competitive instincts and teamwork skills that would define her leadership style.
Georgetown, Harvard, and the Road to Media (04:06): With no family connections to the industry and student loans to repay, Sarnoff built her foundation in strategy consulting before finally making her move into media.
Nickelodeon and MTV (22:23): As head of strategy and research at Nickelodeon, Sarnoff championed deep audience research, running 200 focus groups a year. That rigor produced breakout hits like Rugrats and Blue's Clues.
Audience as North Star (21:21): Sarnoff explains how cable television changed the broadcast model by starting with the customer, building channels around specific passions rather than the broadest possible reach. That philosophy of programming for real audiences became the throughline of her entire career.
Breaking the Barrier at Warner Bros. (28:03): Ann shares her experience of becoming the first female CEO of Warner Bros. in 2019 and occupying Jack Warner's office, her picture joining a wall of men dating back to 1923. Sarnoff reflects on the women who came before her, and guiding the iconic studio through a pandemic, a streaming revolution, and a corporate merger.
What Comes Next (36:00): Sarnoff breaks down how the combination of streaming, COVID-era demand, and supply-side surplus led to a wave of content the industry is only now working through. She's cautiously optimistic that a leaner, more creatively diverse slate is emerging on the other side.
Theaters as Third Spaces (47:04): Drawing on her board role at Regal Cineworld, Sarnoff argues that the future of theatrical exhibition lies in becoming a communal “third space, and that the only real limit is imagination.”

Host: Kevin Goetz
Guest: Ann Sarnoff
Producer: Kari Campano
Writers: Kevin Goetz, Darlene Hayman, and Kari Campano
Audio Engineer: Gary Forbes (DG Entertainment)
For more information about Ann Sarnoff:
Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Sarnoff
IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm2115707/
Forbes: https://www.forbes.com/profi
For more information about Kevin Goetz:
- Website: www.KevinGoetz360.com
- Audienceology Book: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Audience-ology/Kevin-Goetz/9781982186678
- How to Score in Hollywood: https://www.amazon.com/How-Score-Hollywood-Secrets-Business/dp/198218986X/
- Facebook, X, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, Substack: @KevinGoetz360
- LinkedIn @Kevin Goetz
- Screen Engine/ASI Website: www.ScreenEngineASI.com

Send Kevin a Text Message
Stuart Ford, Chairman and CEO of AGC Studios and one of the most influential figures in independent cinema, joins host Kevin Goetz for a candid conversation about his journey from Oxford-educated lawyer to Miramax insider to founder of two major independent studios. Ford reflects on the mentors, deals, and instincts that shaped his career, and shares an optimistic vision for the future of independent film in an era of AI, streaming, and global market expansion.
From Liverpool to Hollywood (04:17): Ford traces his unlikely path from an upbringing in Liverpool through Oxford, where he studied law and caught the entrepreneurial bug managing bands, to becoming an entertainment attorney during the British cinema boom of the early 90s.
Miramax: The Real Film School (09:26): Drawn to the energy of American independent cinema, Ford leveraged his relationship with Miramax's UK office into a move to New York, where he rose to senior executive, co-heading acquisitions and ultimately leading international sales, working with filmmakers including Quentin Tarantino, Anthony Minghella, and James Mangold.
The Birth of IM Global (14:55): After leaving Miramax, Ford moved to Los Angeles, borrowed $5 million from a London hedge fund, and launched IM Global in 2007.
Paranormal Activity (19:50): Ford recounts acquiring the international rights to Paranormal Activity for $250,000 while the film languished at DreamWorks, then orchestrating a midnight screening that helped persuade Paramount to release it. Kevin Goetz reveals that a reshoot suggested by Steven Spielberg raised test scores by 15 to 20 points and sealed the deal.
Launching AGC Studios (29:17): After selling IM Global to a Chinese private equity group, Ford launched AGC Studios in 2018. AGC has since produced nearly 45 films and television shows, including Hitman, Woman of the Hour, The Tinder Swindler, and Those About to Die.
The Art of Risk Management (32:57): Ford lays out his core investment philosophy: financial and creative risk are inseparable, and the key is to manage both simultaneously. He offers Ron Howard's Eden as a case study in successful risk management.
The Future of Independent Film (43:23): Ford shares an optimistic outlook for the independent sector, citing evolving streaming models, cost reductions, and growth in international markets as reasons for optimism. His message for the next generation is simple: responsible filmmaking doesn't mean compromising on creativity. It just means doing it at the right number.

Host: Kevin Goetz
Guest: Stuart Ford
Producer: Kari Campano
Writers: Kevin Goetz, Darlene Hayman, and Kari Campano
Audio Engineer: Gary Forbes (DG Entertainment)
For more information about Stuart Ford:
Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuart_Ford_(entertainment_executive)
IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm1023349/
For more information about Kevin Goetz:
- Website: www.KevinGoetz360.com
- Audienceology Book: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Audience-ology/Kevin-Goetz/9781982186678
- How to Score in Hollywood: https://www.amazon.com/How-Score-Hollywood-Secrets-Business/dp/198218986X/
- Facebook, X, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, Substack: @KevinGoetz360
- LinkedIn @Kevin Goetz
- Screen Engine/ASI Website: www.ScreenEngineASI.com

Send Kevin a Text Message
Filmmaker Ric Roman Waugh joins host Kevin Goetz for a conversation about his unconventional path from stuntman's son to one of Hollywood's most distinctive action directors. Waugh discusses growing up inside the stunt world, his mentors, and his mission to make commercial action films that also deliver an important message. During the conversation, he touches on his collaborations with Dwayne Johnson, Gerard Butler, and Jason Statham, and on films such as Felon, Snitch, Shot Caller, Angel Has Fallen, Greenland, and Shelter that have defined his brand of character-driven action movies.
Working with Tony Scott and Jerry Bruckheimer (02:47): Waugh credits Tony Scott and Jerry Bruckheimer as the mentors who shaped his collaborative instinct…leaders who respected everyone on set, demanded the best, and inspired those around them.
Growing Up in Stunts Unlimited (06:13): Waugh's father, Fred Waugh, was a founding member of Stunts Unlimited, the legendary stunt group led by Hal Needham. Ric grew up on sets and, to his father’s disappointment, was more dazzled by the stuntmen than the movie stars.
In the Writers' Room (15:20): Before directing, Waugh spent years writing originals for producers like Mark Gordon, Neil Moritz, and Jerry Bruckheimer. He describes how this process taught him how Hollywood actually worked.
Finding His Voice and Making Felon (17:54): Inspired by Sidney Lumet's socially-conscious entertainments, he researched the California prison system, became a volunteer parole agent, and made Felon on spec.
Snitch and Dwayne Johnson (24:10): Working with Dwayne Johnson on Snitch was a pivotal experience for Waugh. Both men were at a crossroads in their careers, and this film helped clarify Waugh’s mission: to use the commercial action films as a Trojan horse for social commentary.
The Audience Is the Real Collaborator (29:56): Waugh reflects on his long working relationship with Kevin Goetz and the role of test screenings in his process. Waugh shares how he uses early and formal audience feedback to identify what isn't being communicated.
Marketing in a Distracted World (46:10): Waugh and Goetz discuss the challenge of building audiences for original stories amid the declining effectiveness of traditional marketing.
If you enjoyed this episode, please leave us a review and share it with a fellow film lover. We look forward to bringing you more behind-the-scenes stories next time on Don't Kill the Messenger.

Host: Kevin Goetz
Guest: Ric Roman Waugh
Producer: Kari Campano
Writers: Kevin Goetz, Darlene Hayman, and Kari Campano
Audio Engineer: Gary Forbes (DG Entertainment)
For more information about Ric Roman Waugh:
Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ric_Roman_Waugh
IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0006846/
Instagram:
For more information about Kevin Goetz:
- Website: www.KevinGoetz360.com
- Audienceology Book: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Audience-ology/Kevin-Goetz/9781982186678
- How to Score in Hollywood: https://www.amazon.com/How-Score-Hollywood-Secrets-Business/dp/198218986X/
- Facebook, X, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, Substack: @KevinGoetz360
- LinkedIn @Kevin Goetz
- Screen Engine/ASI Website: www.ScreenEngineASI.com

Send Kevin a Text Message
Hollywood icon Robert Wagner (known as “RJ”) joins host Kevin Goetz for an intimate, wide-ranging conversation about his life and career. From caddying alongside Clark Gable and Cary Grant to starring opposite Spencer Tracy. From the golden age of the studio system to reinventing himself as a television star, Wagner reflects on the journey that made him one of Hollywood's most enduring figures, later delighting a new generation of audiences as Number 2 in the Austin Powers films. He also reflects on his personal life, including his marriage to actress Natalie Wood, and the family and friendships that shaped him, including his wife of nearly four decades, Jill St. John.
Caddying for Legends (06:21): Wagner recounts his early days as a caddy, where he found himself watching Clark Gable, Cary Grant, Fred Astaire, and Randolph Scott walk down the fairway.
Marilyn Monroe and Screen Tests (09:22): As Fox's go-to "screen test guy," Wagner did Marilyn Monroe's first two tests. His own breakthrough came when Zanuck cast him as a shell-shocked soldier in With a Song in My Heart.
Spencer Tracy as Mentor (14:49): Working alongside Tracy in Broken Lance, Wagner earned the older actor's respect and friendship.
Advice from Cary Grant (18:07): When Wagner was preparing to play a thief for It Takes a Thief, he went to Grant for guidance. Years later he would become a television icon again opposite Stefanie Powers in Hart to Hart.
Lou Wasserman and the Move to Television 18:41): At a time when television was considered beneath film stars, Lew Wasserman called Wagner in and told him, "I think this is your medium."
Barbara Stanwyck and Bette Davis (22:43): Wagner speaks warmly about his three-year relationship with Barbara Stanwyck. He also recalls reaching out to Bette Davis after she publicly praised his work.
John Ford Knocks Him Down…Literally (26:39): On the set of a John Ford film, Wagner followed a script direction and glanced toward where music was playing. Ford stopped the scene, questioned him, and knocked him down.
Pink Panther (29:21): When the studio system collapsed, and Fox dropped its contract players, Wagner moved to Rome and worked on The Pink Panther, his all-time favorite film.
Jill St. John, Family, and Friends (36:16): In one of the episode's most moving moments, Wagner reflects on the profound role friends and family have played in his life.
Few careers in Hollywood history span as many eras, genres, or legends as Robert Wagner's, and fewer still have been lived with such grace. 
Host: Kevin Goetz
Guests: Robert Wagner
Producer: Kari Campano
Writers: Kevin Goetz, Darlene Hayman, and Kari Campano
Audio Engineer: Gary Forbes (DG Entertainment)
For more information about Robert Wagner:
Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Wagner
IMDB: https://www.imdb.com/name/n
For more information about Kevin Goetz:
- Website: www.KevinGoetz360.com
- Audienceology Book: https://www.simonandschuster.com/books/Audience-ology/Kevin-Goetz/9781982186678
- How to Score in Hollywood: https://www.amazon.com/How-Score-Hollywood-Secrets-Business/dp/198218986X/
- Facebook, X, Instagram, TikTok, YouTube, Substack: @KevinGoetz360
- LinkedIn @Kevin Goetz
- Screen Engine/ASI Website: www.ScreenEngineASI.com