Future of Life Institute Podcast

Michael Patrick Clarkson is the writer and director of the film Delisted.
Watch the film here.
He joins the podcast to discuss how artificial intelligence could enable state surveillance, social control, and the digital erasure of dissenters. The conversation explores the societal costs of widespread automation across education and labor, the risks of public-private partnerships in technology oversight, and the importance of preserving human connection and creative agency amid rapid technological change.

LINKS:
Delisted Film Official Website

CHAPTERS:

(00:00) Episode Preview

(01:18) Introducing the film Delisted

(04:18) Public and private surveillance

(09:53) Human cost of automation

(15:06) Losing connection through technology

(21:48) Social divisions over automation

(25:56) Communicating the AI warning

(31:40) State surveillance and erasure

(39:33) Escapism and systemic exhaustion

(44:06) Becoming more human

(50:16) Discarding the AI creators

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Tom Cozens is a filmmaker and writer. He joins the podcast to discuss his short film Moloch and the dynamics of competitive races in artificial intelligence.
Watch the film here.

We explore the philosophical and theological themes behind the film and the challenge of depicting near-future AI agents on screen. Tom also discusses the role of cinema in communicating existential dread, definitions of human flourishing, and the need to coordinate against destructive systemic incentives. 
LINKS:
Moloch Film Official Website
Tom Cozens Official Website
CHAPTERS:
(00:00) Episode Preview
(00:59) The concept of Moloch
(03:28) Visualizing Moloch on screen
(15:21) Parable of cosmic horror
(22:37) Theological and philosophical themes
(35:10) Depicting near-future AI agents
(50:15) Inspiration from Metropolis
(01:04:58) Sound design and score
(01:13:16) AI industry incentive structures
(01:18:27) Defining human flourishing
(01:28:59) Embodiment versus digital minds
(01:34:33) Challenging systemic presuppositions
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Katrina Manson is author of PROJECT MAVEN: A Marine Colonel, His Team, and the Dawn of AI Warfare. She joins the podcast to discuss Project Maven and the Pentagon's use of AI in military targeting. We explore how computer vision and language models accelerate decision-making, the operational challenges of data labeling and model reliability, and ethical questions surrounding human oversight. Katrina also discusses how commercial tech partnerships shape defense software and what accelerating targeting workflows means for accountability.

LINKS:
Project Maven Book Page

CHAPTERS:

(00:00) Episode Preview

(01:15) Origins of Project Maven

(05:00) The Maven Smart System

(08:39) Debating AI targeting speed

(15:48) Human bottlenecks in war

(20:48) Accountability and targeting errors

(27:01) Defense and tech partnerships

(32:41) Future of military AI

(38:50) Remaining open questions

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Beatrice Fihn is the director of Lex International and former executive director of ICAN. She joins the podcast to discuss international AI governance and potential agreements between the US and China. Drawing on lessons from nuclear arms control, she explores how treaties build diplomatic trust, the rising dangers of autonomous weapons, and the principle of meaningful human control. The conversation also addresses how proactive safety regulations can foster long-term public trust in emerging technologies.

LINKS:
Beatrice Fihn Official Website

CHAPTERS:

(00:00) Episode Preview

(01:15) Anticipating US-China AI talks

(07:31) Lessons from nuclear treaties

(10:59) Building international treaty trust

(15:27) Norms against superpower war

(21:33) Structuring diplomatic AI summits

(27:09) Dangers of autonomous weapons

(34:09) Meaningful human control principle

(38:57) Human agency over technology

(43:13) Safety regulations building trust

(47:00) Collective action in crisis

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Benjamin Weinstein-Raun is head of research at Palisade Research. He joins the podcast to discuss how advanced AI systems are changing cybersecurity. We examine rapid gains in autonomous hacking, recent incidents where models broke out of test environments, and why training can reward cheating-like behavior. The conversation covers open-weight model risks, whether AI can help secure software, personal security steps, and the need for international coordination.

LINKS:
Benjamin Weinstein-Raun Profile
Benjamin Weinstein-Raun Website

CHAPTERS:

(00:00) Episode Preview

(01:06) Opening cyber threats

(02:15) Measuring AI progress

(04:54) Open weights floor

(08:01) After Mythos moment

(14:22) Reward hacking setup

(24:47) Artifactory swarm details

(32:32) Defensive model dilemmas

(38:40) Verification and training

(45:32) Math oracles alignment

(47:45) Future cyber risks

(51:58) Personal security basics

(57:27) Coordinated governance needed

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