Documentary First

Someone tried to harvest Christian's voice for AI training. The pitch was polished, the project sounded real. But when she responded with ten professional questions, the conversation ended. Permanently.

In this Deep Dive on Episode 275, Christian connects that experience to her conversation with Erik and Christopher Ewers, the brothers behind the PBS documentary Henry David Thoreau. Chris Ewers argues that every technological revolution has felt like the end of the world — the Industrial Revolution, digital cameras, and now AI. Each time the tool became indispensable. Then Christian pulls in Thoreau himself — the man who railed against the railroad and then rode the train 70 times. He used the tool deliberately.

In this episode, you’ll hear:
The full story of the suspicious voice-over job offer and the ten questions that ended it.
Why Christian’s VO business is declining while her filmmaking and podcasting are thriving.
Chris Ewers’s case for why AI is the digital camera revolution all over again.
Thoreau’s “cost of a thing” quote and why it hits differently in the age of AI.
The contradiction of Thoreau and the train — and what “live deliberately” actually means now.
Jeff Goldblum at the mic and George Clooney saying “tell me if I suck” — what AI will never replace.

Timestamps:
0:00 What George Clooney Told the Directors
0:18 Show open
0:28 The Ethan Caldwell story
2:33 Where I stand with AI
3:49 The Ewers Brothers and the revolution that always comes
5:09 Clip: Chris Ewers on AI and the digital camera revolution
7:15 Thoreau, technology, and the train he swore he’d never ride
9:25 What “live deliberately” actually means
9:44 What Ethan Caldwell’s silence reveals
10:45 Goldblum, Clooney, and what machines can’t replicate
11:59 Closing

Listen & Follow:
Apple Podcasts: tinyurl.com/DocFirstApple
Spotify: tinyurl.com/DocFirstSpotify
YouTube: tinyurl.com/DocFirstYouTube
Amazon Music: tinyurl.com/DocFirstAmazon
Support the show on Patreon: tinyurl.com/DocFirstPatreon

About the Guests (from DF Episode 275):

Erik Ewers: Director, Editor. Ken Burns’s senior editor for 33+ years. Multiple Emmy winner. Based in New Hampshire.
Christopher Loren Ewers: Director, DP. 20+ years behind the camera. Based in the NYC metro area.

About Henry David Thoreau (PBS):
A three-part, three-hour documentary. Executive produced by Ken Burns and Don Henley. Narrated by George Clooney. Voices by Jeff Goldblum (Thoreau), Ted Danson (Emerson), Meryl Streep, and Tate Donovan. Available now on PBS and PBS Documentaries on Amazon.

Resources:
Henry David Thoreau (PBS, 2026) | Walden by Henry David Thoreau (1854)

Hear Part 1: Episode 274, “I Didn’t Know Myself: Erik & Chris Ewers on Ken Burns, PBS & Thoreau”
Hear Part 2: Episode 275, "Erik & Chris Ewers on PBS Funding, AI & Directing Goldblum, Clooney & Streep"

Connect:
Ewers Brothers: ewersbrothers.com
Erik Ewers: @melonhd | linkedin.com/in/erik-ewers-38122729
Chris Ewers: @christopher_loren_ewers_dp | linkedin.com/in/christopherewers
Christian Taylor: @meetchristiantaylor I linkedin.com/in/meetchristiantaylor
All platforms: linktr.ee/doc1st

Even with Ken Burns and Don Henley attached, funding a PBS documentary is brutal. So what hope do the rest of us have?

Erik and Christopher Ewers get real about PBS funding, AI’s impact on filmmaking, and how they landed George Clooney, Jeff Goldblum, Ted Danson, Tate Donovan and Meryl Streep for their new PBS documentary Henry David Thoreau.
In Part 2 of this conversation, the Ewers Brothers open up about the financial realities of documentary funding, even with Ken Burns and Don Henley attached, why Chris sees AI as the next revolution instead of the apocalypse, how broadcast is giving way to streaming, and the stories behind casting some of Hollywood’s biggest voices. This is Part 2 of a two-part conversation.
In Part 2, you’ll learn:
— Why having Ken Burns and Don Henley as executive producers doesn’t make funding easy and who actually made the Thoreau film possible
— Chris’s case for why AI is the digital camera revolution all over again, not the death of filmmaking
— The best professional advice Chris ever received and why it will never change
— How Chris kept his mouth shut on a commercial set with Jeff Goldblum and how that silence led to Goldblum voicing Thoreau
— The story of how Don Henley quietly recruited George Clooney as narrator and Clooney’s reaction when asked how long he’d known Henley
— Ken Burns’s advice on directing Meryl Streep: “You don’t.”
— How streaming is changing episode length and why “the director’s cut” isn't what it used to be.
— Erik’s approach to pre-planning edit cuts for PBS broadcast time slots without sacrificing the story
— Why Ken Burns treats his mentorship like tough love — and why Erik is grateful for it
— One thing filmmakers need to know about getting a documentary on PBS

Timestamps:
0:00 Introduction
1:21 Unpacking the Thoreauvian mindset
2:46 Thoreau’s prescience on consumerism
3:50 Erik on Thoreau’s “cost of life” quote and the iPhone
4:40 Thoreau and the birth of the Industrial Revolution
6:03 Christian’s advice: think from the end back
6:50 Chris on the state of the industry — Industrial Revolution to AI
10:20 Christian: as a voice actor, AI is a challenge
10:53 The best professional advice Chris ever received
11:36 Christian on the struggle to fund the next film
12:54 Money is always the biggest hurdle
13:15 How the Ewers Brothers fund PBS docs without federal money
14:49 Ken Burns’s two binders of rejection letters
15:07 The Movies That Made Us — encouragement for indie filmmakers
16:26 The reality: it’s hard for everybody
17:52 Erik on Ken Burns’s legacy projects and the privilege of the brand
20:58 Erik on earning the gift — Ken’s tough love mentorship
22:00 Broadcast vs. streaming — why episode length is changing
23:52 Erik’s editing strategy for PBS time slots
25:37 Celebrity voice talent — how they landed Jeff Goldblum
27:43 Don Henley’s connections — Ted Danson and Meryl Streep
29:09 The George Clooney reveal — “If Don Henley calls, you say yes”
30:43 What it’s like to direct celebrity voice talent
30:55 Jeff Goldblum in the booth — pure instinct
31:26 Ken Burns’s advice on directing Meryl Streep
31:52 George Clooney: “Tell me if I suck”
32:42 DocuVue Deja Vu — Erik’s picks and Chris’s all-time favorite
DocuView DejaVu Picks:
Erik Ewers: Crumb (1994), Hearts of Darkness: A Filmmaker’s Apocalypse (1991), Jiro Dreams of Sushi (2011), The Thin Blue Line (1988)
Christopher Loren Ewers: Man on Wire (2008)
Christian Taylor: Buy Now: The Shopping Conspiracy (Netflix, 2024)

This episode is supported by Virgil Films Entertainment.

About the Guests:
Erik Ewers — Director, Editor. Ken Burns’s senior editor for 33+ years. Multiple Emmy winner. ACE Eddie Award winner (The Roosevelts, 2015). Based in New Hampshire.
Christopher Loren Ewers — Director, DP. 20+ years behind the camera. Commercial clients include Apple, Coca-Cola, Tiffany & Co., Stella Artois, Volvo, Peter Millar. Based in the NYC metro area.
About Henry David Thoreau (PBS):
A three-part, three-hour documentary — the first full-length documentary biography of Thoreau. Executive produced by Ken Burns and Don Henley. Narrated by George Clooney. Voices by Jeff Goldblum (Thoreau), Ted Danson (Ralph Waldo Emerson), Meryl Streep (Lidian Emerson, Margaret Fuller, Mary Merrick Brooks, Maria Thoreau), and Tate Donovan (William Ellery Channing). Available now on PBS and PBS Documentaries on Amazon.

Resources Mentioned:
— Henry David Thoreau (PBS, 2026)
— Buy Now: The Shopping Conspiracy (Netflix, 2024)
— The Movies That Made Us (Netflix)
— Walden; or, Life in the Woods by Henry David Thoreau (1854)
Listen & Follow:
Apple Podcasts: https://tinyurl.com/DocFirstApple
Spotify: tinyurl.com/DocFirstSpotify
YouTube: tinyurl.com/DocFirstYouTube
Amazon Music: tinyurl.com/DocFirstAmazon

Support the show on Patreon: tinyurl.com/DocFirstPatreon

Connect:
Ewers Brothers Productions: ewersbrothers.com
Connect with Christian Taylor on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/meetchristiantaylor
All Documentary First platforms: linktr.ee/doc1st

He edited nearly every Ken Burns film since The Civil War. He still didn't know who he was.

Henry David Thoreau wrote that most people lead lives of “quiet desperation.” But what did he actually mean - and what does it look like inside a successful career?
That’s the question Christian Taylor explores in this episode of Documentary First: The Deep Dive, after her conversation with Erik and Christopher Ewers—two brothers who just directed a three-part, three-hour PBS documentary on Thoreau. The film is narrated by George Clooney, with Jeff Goldblum voicing Thoreau, Ted Danson as Emerson, and Meryl Streep voicing several women in Thoreau’s life. It’s executive produced by Ken Burns and Don Henley.

What struck Christian wasn’t the star-studded cast or the prestige credentials. It was a quiet confession from Erik - Ken Burns’s senior editor for 33 years - who admitted that despite decades of career confidence, he didn’t really know himself. He described himself as “lost and wayward.” And it was his own documentary about youth mental illness that finally woke him up.

That led Christian back to Thoreau’s famous line and to a realization: Thoreau wasn’t describing unhappy people. He was describing people who don’t even know they’re suffering. People whose competence has become the hiding place.
What You’ll Learn:
Why competence can mask a total lack of self-knowledge - for decades
What Thoreau actually meant by “quiet desperation” (it’s not what most people think)
How Erik Ewers’s own documentary became the mirror that showed him himself
The connection between Thoreau’s grief, Christian’s grief, and the impulse to strip life down to what’s real
A practical challenge for filmmakers and creators: rest is where the seeing happens

The Core Idea:
Your craft can take you everywhere - except inward. The stories we tell have the power to tell us something back, but only if we’re paying attention. This episode explores what happens when the noise finally stops and we’re left standing on honest ground.
Featured Guests:
Erik Ewers – Director, Editor. Ken Burns’s senior editor for 33+ years. Multiple Emmy winner. ACE Eddie Award winner (The Roosevelts, 2015). Based in New Hampshire. Has worked on nearly every Burns film since The Civil War (1990). Co-director of Henry David Thoreau (PBS, 2026), Hiding in Plain Sight (2012) and The Mayo Clinic (2018)
Christopher Loren Ewers – Director, DP. 20+ years behind the camera. World-class cinematographer. Has been shooting for Burns and Florentine Films since The Vietnam War. Commercial clients include Apple, Coca-Cola, Stella Artois, Volvo and Peter Millar. Based in the NYC metro area.
Christopher Ewers Commercial Work
About Henry David Thoreau (PBS):
A three-part, three-hour documentary – the first full-length documentary biography of Thoreau. Executive produced by Ken Burns and Don Henley. Narrated by George Clooney. Voices by Jeff Goldblum (Thoreau), Ted Danson (Ralph Waldo Emerson), Meryl Streep, and Tate Donovan. Henry David Thoreau premied on PBS on March 30 and 31, 2026. Available now on PBS and wherever you stream PBS content.
Henry David Thoreau Series Trailer
Part 2 of the interview with Erik and Chris Ewers drops April 9 - covering PBS funding realities, AI and the industry, and how they landed Jeff Goldblum, George Clooney, Tate Donovan and Meryl Streep.
Resources Mentioned:
Henry David Thoreau (PBS, 2026) - available on PBS and PBS Documentaries on Amazon
Hiding in Plain Sight: Youth Mental Illness (PBS, 2022)
Walden; or, Life in the Woods by Henry David Thoreau (1854)

About The Deep Dive:
This companion podcast airs on alternate weeks from the main Documentary First podcast. Every other week, Christian takes one idea from a recent conversation and explores it more deeply - examining what it means, why it matters, and what to do about it.

Hear the full interview:
Listen to Episode 274 of Documentary First for Christian’s complete conversation with Erik and Christopher Ewers about the Thoreau documentary, working with Ken Burns, and the brother dynamic behind the filmmaking.

If you’re enjoying the show, please subscribe and leave a review! For more in-depth discussions, early releases and extra content, support our Patreon: tinyurl.com/DocFirstPatreon

Listen & Follow:
Apple Podcasts: tinyurl.com/DocFirstApple
Spotify: tinyurl.com/DocFirstSpotify
YouTube: tinyurl.com/DocFirstYouTube
Amazon Music: tinyurl.com/DocFirstAmazon

He's edited nearly every Ken Burns film ever made. But he couldn't edit himself.

What does it take to build a filmmaking career inside Ken Burns's world — and what happens when the hardest part isn't the craft, but learning who you are?
Erik and Christopher Ewers are brothers who co-direct for PBS under the Ken Burns banner. Erik has been Burns's senior editor for 33+ years. Chris is a DP who's shot for Apple, Coca-Cola, and Tiffany & Co. Their latest project: Henry David Thoreau, a three-part PBS documentary series executive produced by Ken Burns and Don Henley, narrated by George Clooney, with Jeff Goldblum voicing Thoreau, Ted Danson as Ralph Waldo Emerson, and Meryl Streep. Henry David Thoreau premieres on PBS March 30. This is Part 1 of a two-part conversation.
In Part 1, you'll learn:
— How Erik ended up working for Ken Burns through a real estate deal involving window treatments and carpets
— How a 22-minute visitors center film became the doorway to a three-hour PBS series
— What it's really like to co-direct a documentary with your brother (even Ken Burns couldn't do it with his)
— How Chris balances high-end commercial work with documentary filmmaking to sustain a creative career
— The challenge of filming Walden Pond with only two usable photographs of Thoreau
— Why knowing yourself is the most important skill a filmmaker can develop — and Erik's deeply personal story about discovering that through his own film

Part 2 drops April 9 — covering PBS funding realities, AI and the industry, and how they landed Jeff Goldblum, George Clooney, and Meryl Streep.
This episode is supported by Virgil Films Entertainment.
About the Guests:
Erik Ewers — Director, Editor. Ken Burns's senior editor for 33+ years. Multiple Emmy winner. ACE Eddie Award winner (The Roosevelts, 2015). Based in New Hampshire.
Christopher Loren Ewers — Director, DP. 20+ years behind the camera. Commercial clients include Apple, Coca-Cola, Tiffany & Co., Stella Artois, Volvo. Based in the NYC metro area.

About Henry David Thoreau (PBS):
A three-part, three-hour documentary — the first full-length documentary biography of Thoreau. Executive produced by Ken Burns and Don Henley. Narrated by George Clooney. Voices by Jeff Goldblum (Thoreau), Ted Danson (Ralph Waldo Emerson), Meryl Streep, and Tate Donovan. Henry David Thoreau premieres on PBS March 30. Available on PBS and wherever you stream PBS content.
Christopher Ewers Commerical Work
Henry David Throeau Series Trailer
Listen & Follow:
Apple Podcasts: https://tinyurl.com/DocFirstApple
Spotify: tinyurl.com/DocFirstSpotify
YouTube: tinyurl.com/DocFirstYouTube
Amazon Music: tinyurl.com/DocFirstAmazon
Connect:
Ewers Brothers Productions
Christian Taylor on X
Christian Taylor on Instagram
Christian Taylor on LinkedIn
Documentary First on X
Documentary First on Instagram
Documentary First Productions
Linktree

In Bridgerton Season 4, Francesca Bridgerton stands in the middle of her husband’s funeral and says something no one expects: “I want to feel joy.”
Eighty years earlier and four thousand miles away, a D-Day veteran stood on Utah Beach watching children play in the water where his friends had died—and said something just as unexpected: “That’s why we came.”
In this episode of Documentary First: The Deep Dive, Christian Taylor connects these two moments to a discovery C.S. Lewis made in his grief journal A Grief Observed—and asks what it all means for the stories we tell as filmmakers. The answer surprised her. It might surprise you too.
What You’ll Learn:
What 20+ D-Day veterans told filmmaker Jake Schroeder when he asked if it was disrespectful to play on the beaches where men died
The C.S. Lewis line that connects grief, praise, and joy—and why filmmakers need to hear it
How Bridgerton Season 4, Episode 7 modeled a radically different response to loss
G.K. Chesterton’s 1908 concept that reframes everything: why joy might be bigger than the pain
Christian’s challenge to filmmakers: What if we gave our audiences permission to dance?

The Core Insight:
C.S. Lewis noticed that his grief wasn’t bringing him closer to his wife—it was cutting him off from her. Only in moments of least sorrow did she come rushing back, vivid and whole. He realized there are different modes of loving someone you’ve lost: grief focuses on the absence, but praise focuses on the fullness. And when love takes the form of praise, joy shows up inside it without being forced.
That’s what Francesca Bridgerton discovered at John’s celebration of life. It’s what Anthony Malin was doing when he watched children splash on Utah Beach and wept. Same love. Different mode.
Plus:
Christian’s personal story of losing her mom and finding A Grief Observed
Why the most powerful story we can tell might not be about the suffering—but about the moment after
How The Girl Who Wore Freedom approaches joy in the soil soaked with blood

Featured Guest:
Jake Schroeder—Founder of the D-Day Leadership Academy, former professional musician and youth sports director. Jake brings high school students to Normandy to learn leadership through the stories of D-Day, and has spent years taking veterans back to the beaches where they fought.
References Mentioned:
Bridgerton Season 4, Episode 7: “The Beyond” (Netflix)
C.S. Lewis — A Grief Observed
G.K. Chesterton — Orthodoxy (1908)
Jake Schroeder / D-Day Leadership Academy
The Girl Who Wore Freedom (Christian Taylor’s film)
Anthony Malin — D-Day veteran, LST driver, Utah Beach

About The Deep Dive:
This companion podcast airs on alternate weeks from the main Documentary First podcast. Every other week, Christian takes one powerful idea from a recent conversation and explores it more deeply—examining what it means, why it matters, and what to do about it.
Hear the full interview:
Listen to Episode 273 of Documentary First for Christian’s complete conversation with Jake Schroeder about D-Day, leadership, and what veterans can teach us about purpose.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/4lp6cdjyyd52omtOQB6Tz8?si=88968b4ec2794312
If you’re enjoying the show, please subscribe and leave a review!