Uncensored CMO

Thomas Barta is one of the world’s leading experts on marketing leadership. A former McKinsey partner, CEO of the Marketing Leadership Institute, and co-author of The 12 Powers of a Marketing Leader, Thomas has studied what makes CMOs successful through the largest global research project of its kind, over 68,000 leadership assessments.
In this episode, we explore what CEOs really expect from CMOs, why so few marketers make it to the boardroom, and what needs to change if marketing is to lead growth again. Thomas shares practical tactics for building stronger CFO relationships, acting with more bravery, and avoiding the “safe” behaviours that quietly kill careers. A must-listen for any marketer serious about leadership.
Sign up to our live event, The Calling, on April 21st here:
https://event.uncensoredcmo.com/events/uncensoredcmo/2044861

Timestamps
00:00 - Intro
00:43 - How Thomas Barta got into marketing
02:24 - The surprising thing about marketing at the board level
03:52 - What is the CEO looking for a CMO to deliver
04:41 - Why are there so few marketers in the boardroom
08:38 - What tactics should marketers use to make sure they are delivering growth
11:20 - How can CMOs build the relationship with their CFO
12:53 - CMO Tenure - is it going up or down?
18:59 - What do CMOs need to change?
21:13 - Fitting in is the safest way to fail
28:11 - The bravery formula
29:48 - Why you need to act quickly
31:07 - Confessions of a CMO

With Cannes Lions deadlines looming, Jon and Kory dive into what it really takes to pitch, and win, at Cannes.

We recorded this episode on the final day of Cannes 2025, with Kory in the thick of e.l.f’s "So Many D*cks" campaign submission for both a Glass and Titanium Lion. With the experience fresh in her mind, she breaks down the realities of the process.

Jon brings a different perspective, reflecting on his own Bronze and Silver Lion wins from years past, and the hard-earned lessons that came with them.
This is an episode of the Uncensored Renegades podcast. We'll only be posting a few more episodes of Renegades on this feed. To hear episodes of this new show, subscribe in your podcast app of choice:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/uncensored-renegades/id1868870960
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7qnkqq0XSpgif9A5ZNgSpX?si=f181c3a0e9af480c

Timestamps

00:00 - Intro
00:49 - The pitching process for a Cannes Lion
03:14 - The pitch process for a Glass Lion
06:51 - The power of the Pratfall Effect
08:39 - Pitching for a Titanium Lion
10:41 - Jon’s tips from winning his Silver and Bronze Lions
12:17 - Audience before content
14:14 - How to make your campaign interesting (and not dull)
16:25 - How e.l.f. makes their campaigns interesting
18:58 - How to hack your campaign; babies or animals

Syl Saller CBE is one of the most respected marketing leaders of her generation. Former Global Chief Marketing and Innovation Officer at Diageo, Syl helped lead a FTSE 10 business with more than 200 brands across 180 countries. Today, she’s an executive coach and mentor, President of The Marketing Society, and works closely with C-suite leaders to develop the next generation of marketing leadership.
In this episode, Syl shares what the CMO role at Diageo is really like, how to build strong relationships with CEOs and boards, and how to navigate imposter syndrome, difficult conversations, and career-defining moments. We also discuss why she left Diageo, what she’d do differently looking back, and the leadership lessons she now passes on to others.
Sign up to our live event, The Calling, on April 21st here:
https://event.uncensoredcmo.com/events/uncensoredcmo/2044861
Timestamps

00:00 - Intro
00:53 - What’s a CMO role at Diageo really like?
02:56 - How to have difficult conversations
03:59 - Whats it like being on the board of Diageo?
05:04 - Working with Sir Ivan Menezes, legendary Diageo CEO
09:10 - How to foster a great relationship with your CEO
12:38 - How Syl Saller’s childhood shaped her into the leader she is today
18:57 - What would Syl Saller do differently in her career
21:29 - How to deal with imposter syndrome as a leader
25:31 - How to figure out your life and career plan
28:08 - The toolkit for planning success
31:40 - Why the challenging moments in life can have the best outcomes
34:17 - Maintaining a good work life balance with a senior job
38:51 - Why Syl left Diageo in 2020
40:11 - Why Syl Saller became a leadership coach after leaving Diageo
43:10 - Three bits of leadership advice from Syl Saller

This is an episode of the Uncensored Renegades podcast. To hear episodes of this new show, subscribe here:
Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/uncensored-renegades/id1868870960
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7qnkqq0XSpgif9A5ZNgSpX?si=f181c3a0e9af480c
When you define any other business function, the answer is simple. What is finance? What is HR? What is IT?
When you ask, what is marketing? The answer is broad. Is it sales? Is it storytelling? Is it brand?
In this episode, Kory and Jon dig into some of the words used to define marketing and decrypt some of the findings.
Timestamps
00:00 - Intro
00:15 - Why is marketing hard to define?
04:35 - Why brand is so important
08:36 - How your brand shows up when hiring people
10:36 - The words that describe marketing
14:47 - Do marketers neglect the role of strategy?
17:25 - The most surprising words that define marketing
18:39 - The power of storytelling

The last time I spoke to today's guest, James Watt, he fired me. It's the first thing we talk about in the episode, but I have nothing but respect for the man who built Brewdog into the Unicorn it is today. Through their impressive marketing stunts, focus on product quality and immense speed of execution, Brewdog successfully took on the beer behemoths and solidified its place in the industry. In this episode we talk about why James made a mistake hiring an executive team (including me), how they convinced a bank to give them a loan in the global financial crisis and how he almost lost £50m to a Russian bank account. Now, James has launched a new venture, Social Tip, a new way brands can connect with consumers.
Sign up to our live event, The Calling, on April 21st here:
https://event.uncensoredcmo.com/events/uncensoredcmo/2044861
Timestamps
00:00 - Intro
00:58 - Why did James fire Jon?
01:56 - Being in the detail and close to the customer
06:07 - Brewdog founding story: how they got funding
08:54 - Why Brewdog is so passionate about making a great product
13:07 - How Brewdog won their Tesco listing
15:58 - How a Tesco listing transformed Brewdog
17:37 - The secret to an overnight success
20:22 - Why constraints led to great marketing for Brewdog
22:09 - Examples of Brewdog’s incredible marketing stunts
27:43 - Why James changed his name to Elvis
29:28 - Collaborating with copycats: launching ALD IPA
31:14 - When marketing stunts go wrong
33:28 - How James almost lost £50 million
37:48 - James Watt’s favourite business books
41:17 - How James Watt felt when he left Brewdog
43:01 - Leadership lessons from James Watt about scaling
46:05 - Dealing with public scrutiny
47:26 - Why James started his new business: Social Tip
54:03 - How to pitch your business to James Watt